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THE DAY IS HERE! FIRMWARE 1.50 HAS FIXED THE GLITCH!!!! Thank you to everyone who contributed their experiences, pictures, and support. My thread would be nothing without you. I truly believe that we greatly expedited the process of getting this addressed by Sony. All of your calls, letters, e-mails, and on-line chats with Sony made all the difference. THANK YOU SO MUCH! At the risk of sounded extremely sappy, I really am going to miss some of the big contributors to this thread. We had a common problem and really pulled together to get this issue out there on the web beyond this forum. The-Sarge, Esuom25, RUSirius, Smooof Ed, Telumendil, mechakucha, topbravo, Blykmik, technoMyst, RedRedSuit, Vicious_Dave, Tenacious G, aeonblue, Tha-Dave, Tanoshimi, Flippy, Abrader, and Xenokai, (sorry for those I missed) thank you for your tenacity. Especially you Sarge. Remind me never to piss you off. LOL. Slurrey, thank you for the controversial video that garnered so much attention. IT'S FIXED PEOPLE! Now this big ol' thread can retire.  I decided to start this thread because many of my PS2 games were looking horrible on my HDTV when played through the PS3. The games look fantastic when I play them via component from my PS2. So I used the SAME component cable on my PS3, kept the picture adjustments the same, and even set the PS3's output resolution to 480i to emulate what the PS2 was doing. Here are my results on the SAME TV. Since I am setting up my PS3 to the SAME conditions that my PS2 outputs, I do not believe this is a TV issue as some here have asserted. Sony thus far has played dumb when we call them. Look at the screen caps below and you decide. ___________________________________________________________ Please take the time to "digg" this story on Digg.com to get it some more much needed attention. Thanks. ___________________________________________________________
What is known: That a majority of the games affected are games that do not have 480p coded into them. It SEEMS that 480i only games are the ones exhibiting this glitch the most. If a 480p capable game (ie Resident Evil 4, God of War) does have the issue, turning on the progressive scan option in the game often solves the problem. I have personally not confirmed that PS1 games have the pixel flipping issue but others have claimed it does the same thing. I don't notice the issue on PS1 games other than they look like garbage to to the horrible pixels and low rez of those games. Playing those via HDMI on a HDTV looks awful as expected. Since the PS3 doesn't have the texture smoothing option that the PS2 did, I would recommend using the supplied composite cables for those. Some people have hastily said it is ALL games which is not true. We ARE NOT saying that ALL PS2 games look like crap on the PS3 so knock it off with the flaming. Changing cables from HDMI to component to composite cables does not rectify the issue. Changing to a non-HD TV without scalers does not fix the issue either. Firmware upgrade 1.50 has fixed the glitch! There is a "pixel flipping" theory that seems logical but is not yet confirmed. Pictures of that are below. "The-Sarge" has been quite vigilent with calling Sony and one of techs FINALLY acknowledged that there is a problem and stated that the PS3 is having emulation problems with the PS2. We'll post more here as we learn more. Please list all games tested that exhibit this problem and if you can, post screen shots of what the game looks like on a PS2 and what it looks like on PS3 coming from the SAME CABLE AND TV. A few posters have experimented with the Xploder HD disc to output 480i games at 480p. Lo and behold this fixes the problem (even on Final Fantasy XII). This all but confirms that this problem CAN BE FIXED VIA SOFTWARE PATCH. One of the posters in the thread sent an e-mail complaint to Sony support in Japan. Here is the translation of what was said. It offers a glimmer of hope that this can be fixed. " PLAYSTATION 3’s output is 480i/480p/720p/1080i/1080p, but PlayStation/PlayStation 2 software is played back at the resolution that is on the disc. When PS/PS2 software is played on the PS3, the interlaced signal is converted to a progressive signal (IP conversion/transformation). Because of this, the PS3's picture has noticeable roughness when compared to the PS2. For example, depending on the software’s original recording, outlines can be jagged/notched. Please understand.
Furthermore, from the home menu under [Settings] > [Display Settings] > [Video Output Settings] is Standard NTSC selected? In case you’re using an HDMI cable, please try using the included AV cables as they smooth the outlines. Please give it a try. Concerning the IP conversion/transformation, there are plans to improve it in an upcoming update. "
Here is the list of games that we have confirmed have the issue based upon posters claims and comparison screen shots. If you have more, please respond to this thread as I keep a close eye and update this original post anytime new info comes out. Known games with the issue: Final Fantasy XII - 480i only game - the worst of the worst Final Fantasy X - 480i only game Final Fantasy X-2 - 480i only game Metal Gear Solid 2 - 480i only game Metal Gear Solid 3 - 480i only game Metal Gear Solid 3: Substinence - 480i only game Virtua Fighter 4 - 480i only game Virtua Fighter 4: Evolution - 480i only game Dragon Quest VIII - 480i only game WWE Smackdown! vs. RAW 2007 - 480i only game Devil May Cry 3: Special Edition - 480i only game Time Splitters 2 - 480i only game Time Splitters: Future Perfect - 480i only game Mark of Kri - 480i only game Kingdom Hearts - 480i only game Kingdom Hearts 2 - 480i only game ICO - 480i only game YS: The Ark of Napishtim - 480i game God of War - 480p able - turning on progressive scan in game options solves the problem Resident Evil 4 - 480p able - turning on progressive scan in game options solves the problem Resident Evil: Outbreak - 480i only game Mortal Kombat: Armageddon - 480p able - turning on progressive scan in game options solves the problem Transformers - 480i only game Legacy of Kain 2 - 480i only game Silent Hill 3 - 480i only game Silent Hill 4 - 480i only game Rogue Galaxy - 480i only game We Heart Katamari - 480i only game Shining Force Neo - 480i only game DBZ: Budoki Tenkaichi - 480i only game Whiplash - 480i only game Ace Combat 5 - 480i only game Winning Eleven 7 - 480i only game Winning Eleven 8 - 480i only game Ratchet & Clank: Deadlocked - 480p able - turning on progressive scan in game options solves the problem Ratchet & Clank: Up Your Arsenal - 480p able - turning on progressive scan in game options solves the problem Xenosaga Episode 1 - 480i only game Xenosaga Episode 2 - 480i only game Dark Cloud - 480i only game Dark Cloud 2 - 480i only game Shadowhearts: From the New World - 480i only game more to come as people post more results....... BIG UPDATE: Game Informer has made note of this backwords compatibility problem in the January 2007 issue of the magazine under the drawbacks of the PS3, even mentioning Final Fantasy XII by name. I'm sure this brought to their attention by this thread, so thank you all for your continued feedback and discussion! We are getting some love from ZDNet. It's great to have some help! Here is the latest blog entry from Mr. Kingsley-Hughes. Give it a read! "Hi there all! This is my first post here - I signed up especially to post this. My name is Adrian W Kingsley-Hughes and I'm a tech blogger over on ZDNet and I'd just like to say that I've just finished reading through the 50+ pages of this thread and and you folks have done a marvelous job of documenting and detailing this complex issue. I've already given your plight with the PS3 and Sony tech support some coverage but I plan of a fuller, more detailed article later today. The way I see it, the problems that you face are one of getting people (at Sony and other PS3 owners) to acknowledge that a problem exists. My initial investigations seem to suggest that while Sony does, in part at least, acknowledge that there's a problem here, the belief is that it's very limited, small scale and not that serious. Your evidence seems to show otherwise. I'd like to touch base with a few of you who have had issues with your PS3s to discuss the issue further and get some of your thoughts and feelings about it. Please feel free to contact me via this forum or through the contact pages here or here. Here's hoping for a speedy resolution to this problem." Here are some examples of the issue. The most obvious offender is Final Fantasy XII. Final Fantasy XII running on PS2:
NOW, Here is the game running on the SAME CABLE to the SAME TV with the SAME OUTPUT RESOLUTIONS SETTINGS on the PS3:
 
Metal Gear Solid 2 on PS2 (some jaggies but still decent) Metal Gear Solid 2 on PS3 (take a look at the stairway railings!)
Here is the Kojima logo from Metal Gear Solid 3 on PS2
And here is the same logo on the PS3 (holy jaggies!)
Here is a screen from Final Fantasy X on PS2
And the same logo from Final Fantasy X coming from the PS3
And as a finale, here is a close-up of Reks in Final Fantasy XII on PS2 (it looks like crap up close I know)
Now here he is when I play on the PS3 (looks WAY WORSE! Ugh!)
  Okay, to further illustrate Kazriko's point of the pixels getting "flipped" around... I've blown up the logo from that more detailed image.... Here is the original S... Now if we "cut" a section of pixels out (approx 4x4)... I've moved them off to the side and "pointed" at them... Now if we take that block of pixels and "flip" them horizontally, then move them back into place... (the flip can be observed by looking at the arrow which i flipped WITH the pixels.... Now it's obviously "rough", but we can see that CLEARLY the pixels were MEANT to go in there THAT way, NOT the way they show up... Let's do the same for a section of the "X".... Here's the original X... Now let's isolate a section of pixels again.... Once again we'll "flip" them horizontally and move them back into place... Again, it's still rough, but it's EASY to see that this is EXACTLY what's taking place here... We could continue to flip these "blocks" on the entire image and it would look darn near perfect... Below are some screen caps of God of War demonstrating what the game looks like in 480i versus turning on the 480p feature in the game. Basically, 480i games exibiting this problem are screwed until Sony takes action. And here's the pixel flip demonstrated once again... Here is a good shot of a scene in Rogue Galaxy to support the pixel flipping theory. You can see what looks like "clear vertical bars" cutting into the face and CREATING jaggies. Here is a great example of the "clear bars" creating jaggies on Shining Force Neo. It looks SO much worse on a big screen TV. I hope this convinces all the doubters and Sony (fingers crossed). We want ALL backwards compatility to work!
Thanks,
Flumshid
Message Edited by Flumshid on 01-24-2007 09:11 AM
Proud to be part of the 12th man! Go Hawks!
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